So, as a white, 48 year old male with a tiny platform writing my first novel in a less than popular genre (speculative, I guess?)...forget about traditional publishing 😂
Just a pinch of hope here, though, admittedly, it's from 2017. My editor at the time, a senior editor at Random House whose author roster included some of the top-selling male franchise authors, told me that debut fiction by men just didn't come across her desk very often, so when it did, she paid attention.
Thanks, Michelle, so there's some hope! But as you say, 2017...I think so much has changed since then.
But actually, the good news is (I guess?) that I'm not even attempting to get it published. I decided from the get go to go the self-publishing route. This will be my 5th book, but first novel, and in fact, chapter 1 is coming next week on Substack. I'm serialising it. Let's see how it goes.
When I was writing stories in my younger years, they were not well rounded or professional at all... certainly not suitable for publication. I've self-published my own books, yet to any fanfare of course, but I did this knowing that no one would take an interest. It's surprising really, because (no offense to the young), us "olds" have more experience and can create richer worlds. Just my 2 cents.
I think older writers are definitely getting published, and even having a moment. They're just likely to be getting the very large first-book advances.
Thanks for this analysis. I’m soaking up everything I can about the industry as a prep to query my first manuscript (romcom). As a 47 yo white guy I’m discouraged but not daunted!
I’m an old, white, male who writes military political Technothrillers. I found a tiny hybrid press focused on science fiction and fantasy. I tried finding a literary agent for my first book without success. The market has gotten even worse for traditional publishing of these types of stories. Everything I read just reinforces why I’m taking matters into my own hands. I started a Substack science fiction newsletter last August and have slowly picked up readers. I don’t expect big sales when my book comes out either late this year or early next year. It will get published.
You’re getting yourself out there and that’s wonderful! People will want to read what you have to offer. I’m excited for you. It’s really a great time to be an author.
I'm curious what these men are actually pitching, comping, and trying to sell. Are men and women submitting 50/50? Are they pitching in the same genres?
It's a good question. I do wonder though if the female readership is the bigger issue because that would turn a lot of editors off a book that isn't speaking to that market. Nothing lasts forever though I have to admit!
In today’s world, I’m searching always for oblivion and a happy ending. Currently reading How to Read a Book, recently finished Lennie and Margot’s Hundred Years and Malibu Rising. I’m writing dark, but humorous (I think, anyway! 😂) YA, riches to rags—and still querying a MG contemporary, which I may self publish. I hate the ageism, but knew that would be a factor all along. It’s everywhere, but it’s not stopping me!
Oh wait! I thought you were talking about TJR’s The Seven Husbands of Evelyn Hugo, lol. I see now there is a book The Husbands. I haven’t tried that one. I’m actually reading Elinor Lipman’s latest book EVERY TOM, DICK, & HARRY. (I love love love her novel, ISABEL’S BED which is set on the cape so would be a great get-out-of-your-headspace summer novel.)
Very informative. Thank you. The comments held a certain intrigue as well, and it was interesting to note only one male ( apart from self ) has commented. I presume, being a white, baby boomer over 65 my relevance in the literary realm has received its final nail. It now runs parallel to a wooly mammoth. Such is ageism. One writes for the joy of exploration and enlightenment not the momentary rush of TikTok adulation. Such is the embalming fluid of the retired.
Remember Mary Wesley, over 70 when first published, at a time when the book industry was still male dominated. Good writing should rise to the top, have you thought of creating a pseudonym!
A pseudonym, definitely an idea for some. These days I worry about confusing myself with the dog or the fridge. I just have remember; dog pick up after, fridge put into and writing put out there.
This makes me sad. Some of my favorite writers are men: Richard Russo, Stephen King, Bill Roorbach, Kevin St. Jarre. I don’t know. Maybe the answer for older women and men is going to be small presses? And indie publishing? Although, maybe being really good in a smaller field of male authors might actually be a better position than being a good enough writer in a vast field of female writers? Hard to say.
I had no idea the weird girl, messy life genre was trending. Some years ago, in my role as editor of the micro press Fiction Attic, I published a novella called RETURN ON INVESTMENT by Magdalena Waz. It's millennial fiction about the urban gig economy, and I think Waz was both of her time and uncannily prescient. This post was such a fun read, and illuminating. Thank you!
Yes! Back from the days of blog tours! Also the southern connection, right? I remembered your name but didn't put it together. It's so fun to see you here! It seems like we all landed on Substack. I love it because it's easier to follow what writers are doing on a regular basis than the twittererverse or blogspot.
Are you able to share how you research these deals? Is it PM only or? I’m a sociology major turned book agent so this is getting all my wheels turning!
That’s super impressive. It must take hours to compile all this! Thank you! I’d be curious if you ever go deep into a specific genre. Say cookbooks perhaps? 😉 I have some thoughts on certain hypotheses that I’ve never had the time to fully research. Yet. Let me know if you’re intrigued and would want to combine forces. I’m so happy to have found your work!
Thanks, Sally. I stick to fiction authors because that's my readership but it didn't take me that long. Maybe a few hours. You should explore those hypotheses. I was really surprised how youth oriented the deals were. I know it's a mostly Booktok thing but it held true in lit deals too.
Older, male, writer of literary fiction - no chance! But that's okay (and it's why I publish my own stuff; I have 'control'). The key is to really know why you're writing and to be happy with that. If you're in a 'certain demographic' and want fortune and glory then you're probably off your rocker!
So, as a white, 48 year old male with a tiny platform writing my first novel in a less than popular genre (speculative, I guess?)...forget about traditional publishing 😂
I think the right project can sell but it is a tough road.
Just a pinch of hope here, though, admittedly, it's from 2017. My editor at the time, a senior editor at Random House whose author roster included some of the top-selling male franchise authors, told me that debut fiction by men just didn't come across her desk very often, so when it did, she paid attention.
Thanks, Michelle, so there's some hope! But as you say, 2017...I think so much has changed since then.
But actually, the good news is (I guess?) that I'm not even attempting to get it published. I decided from the get go to go the self-publishing route. This will be my 5th book, but first novel, and in fact, chapter 1 is coming next week on Substack. I'm serialising it. Let's see how it goes.
This definitely makes me sad - I'm an old :(
When I was writing stories in my younger years, they were not well rounded or professional at all... certainly not suitable for publication. I've self-published my own books, yet to any fanfare of course, but I did this knowing that no one would take an interest. It's surprising really, because (no offense to the young), us "olds" have more experience and can create richer worlds. Just my 2 cents.
I'm with you 100 percent. But every now and then, an older voice breaks through like Bonnie Garmus.
I think older writers are definitely getting published, and even having a moment. They're just likely to be getting the very large first-book advances.
Let me know if you hear of any. That would be some welcome news!
“Why men are not reading novels?”
Well, have they tried publishing something that is not some form of romance? No book on this list appeals to me as a reader 😂
Thanks for this analysis. I’m soaking up everything I can about the industry as a prep to query my first manuscript (romcom). As a 47 yo white guy I’m discouraged but not daunted!
Best of luck, Sean.
I’m an old, white, male who writes military political Technothrillers. I found a tiny hybrid press focused on science fiction and fantasy. I tried finding a literary agent for my first book without success. The market has gotten even worse for traditional publishing of these types of stories. Everything I read just reinforces why I’m taking matters into my own hands. I started a Substack science fiction newsletter last August and have slowly picked up readers. I don’t expect big sales when my book comes out either late this year or early next year. It will get published.
You’re getting yourself out there and that’s wonderful! People will want to read what you have to offer. I’m excited for you. It’s really a great time to be an author.
I'm curious what these men are actually pitching, comping, and trying to sell. Are men and women submitting 50/50? Are they pitching in the same genres?
I’d love to know as well but that kind of data isn’t readily available.
It's a good question. I do wonder though if the female readership is the bigger issue because that would turn a lot of editors off a book that isn't speaking to that market. Nothing lasts forever though I have to admit!
In today’s world, I’m searching always for oblivion and a happy ending. Currently reading How to Read a Book, recently finished Lennie and Margot’s Hundred Years and Malibu Rising. I’m writing dark, but humorous (I think, anyway! 😂) YA, riches to rags—and still querying a MG contemporary, which I may self publish. I hate the ageism, but knew that would be a factor all along. It’s everywhere, but it’s not stopping me!
Good for you! I admire unstopppable people. Malibu Rising is on my nightstand. Maybe I'll try it next. I had to DNF The Husbands.
Agree about Husbands, but I finished it anyway. Loved Daisy Jones, though. Still have Malibu on my TBR.
I also have DJ on my stack. I'll dive in. Thanks.
Oh wait! I thought you were talking about TJR’s The Seven Husbands of Evelyn Hugo, lol. I see now there is a book The Husbands. I haven’t tried that one. I’m actually reading Elinor Lipman’s latest book EVERY TOM, DICK, & HARRY. (I love love love her novel, ISABEL’S BED which is set on the cape so would be a great get-out-of-your-headspace summer novel.)
I've read Lipman and have enjoyed her.
Malibu was okay, TBH. The Wedding People—loved the structure, the vignettes and humor.
Very informative. Thank you. The comments held a certain intrigue as well, and it was interesting to note only one male ( apart from self ) has commented. I presume, being a white, baby boomer over 65 my relevance in the literary realm has received its final nail. It now runs parallel to a wooly mammoth. Such is ageism. One writes for the joy of exploration and enlightenment not the momentary rush of TikTok adulation. Such is the embalming fluid of the retired.
You should keep going!
Remember Mary Wesley, over 70 when first published, at a time when the book industry was still male dominated. Good writing should rise to the top, have you thought of creating a pseudonym!
A pseudonym, definitely an idea for some. These days I worry about confusing myself with the dog or the fridge. I just have remember; dog pick up after, fridge put into and writing put out there.
This makes me sad. Some of my favorite writers are men: Richard Russo, Stephen King, Bill Roorbach, Kevin St. Jarre. I don’t know. Maybe the answer for older women and men is going to be small presses? And indie publishing? Although, maybe being really good in a smaller field of male authors might actually be a better position than being a good enough writer in a vast field of female writers? Hard to say.
As always, discoverability is a major hurdle.
Well-put, Kevin. I love the "the embalming fluid of the retired." Sounds like you have a voice that should be heard.
Thrillers and mysteries seem to have been hot for a while now.
Yes. Seem to be evergreen.
I think people need the escape.
"The bias against older writers deserves its own post, so I’ll address that in a future issue."
Yes, please!
Any nonfiction?
There are always non-fiction deals of course! But I haven't studied those yet.
Oof. I must be old and out of touch because none of those stories pitched got me excited to read them. Maybe the next round will be more appealing.
I hear that. Lots of novels aimed at the younger set.
I had no idea the weird girl, messy life genre was trending. Some years ago, in my role as editor of the micro press Fiction Attic, I published a novella called RETURN ON INVESTMENT by Magdalena Waz. It's millennial fiction about the urban gig economy, and I think Waz was both of her time and uncannily prescient. This post was such a fun read, and illuminating. Thank you!
You’re welcome, Michelle. You might not remember but we go back a ways. I think it was Girlfriend Cyner Circuit.
Yes! Back from the days of blog tours! Also the southern connection, right? I remembered your name but didn't put it together. It's so fun to see you here! It seems like we all landed on Substack. I love it because it's easier to follow what writers are doing on a regular basis than the twittererverse or blogspot.
A Good Blog is Hard to Find! I adore Substack and it's great to see you here too.
Are you able to share how you research these deals? Is it PM only or? I’m a sociology major turned book agent so this is getting all my wheels turning!
Thanks, Sally, it's all PM ,but then I research the individual author so I can get an idea of age and platform.
That’s super impressive. It must take hours to compile all this! Thank you! I’d be curious if you ever go deep into a specific genre. Say cookbooks perhaps? 😉 I have some thoughts on certain hypotheses that I’ve never had the time to fully research. Yet. Let me know if you’re intrigued and would want to combine forces. I’m so happy to have found your work!
Thanks, Sally. I stick to fiction authors because that's my readership but it didn't take me that long. Maybe a few hours. You should explore those hypotheses. I was really surprised how youth oriented the deals were. I know it's a mostly Booktok thing but it held true in lit deals too.
You’ve inspired me!
Older, male, writer of literary fiction - no chance! But that's okay (and it's why I publish my own stuff; I have 'control'). The key is to really know why you're writing and to be happy with that. If you're in a 'certain demographic' and want fortune and glory then you're probably off your rocker!
Agree. Robert Plant talked about his music and his love for it saying “the syringe got into the arm and never left.” That’s how I feel about writing.
This bodes well for me 😈